Preschool, Our Education Under The Microscope I

Hi everyone,

I wanted to post this topic earlier in response to what precious requested on another topic. But, as I said there, I have been absent for more than a year and the forum has surprisingly changed. I even considered myself a newbie again. And the unwritten forums law states that a newbie shouldn’t start his/her own topic until he/she is familiar with the forum and its members. But in the past couple of days I spent a hel-lot of time reading different topics and different posts here. And now I think I have an idea about ur POV’s on different topics (I’m talking about the members who joined the forum during my absence. I know the old-school members well enough) and im ready to start this topic.

Since the educational system is a very wide subject, I think we better take each stage of education in an isolated topic and discuss it separately and not cross to the next stage until we’re absolutely done with the current one. I know most of you have soooo much to say about university education in specific, but I suggest we take it from the start and come to that later inshalla.

Although we may spot some light on some of the educational systems worldwide, the goal of the “our education under the microscope” series of topics is not merely to compare our system to others’. It is, however, to demonstrate the flaws of our system, make new suggestions to improve it, and make use of only the good things in other systems (differences between our system and other systems don’t necessarily indicate advantages over ours, which is why we’re not here to discuss differences).

Now let’s start with the first stage of the educational system in our country, the Preschool. As you all know, there are three distinct levels of preschool in our system:

1- 7a’9ana (nursery school): the object of this school is to take care of children between the ages of 2 and 5. It doesn’t provide any special educational program or care. The only benefit it provides is that it prepares children to be a bit more ready to attend school away from their parents.

2- Raw’9a (pre-kindergarten): children attend raw’9a are usually of the ages 4-5. There are no prerequisites for children to be admitted. Even though children spend most of their time in the playgrounds, they start getting used to sitting in classrooms. And as its name indicates, it prepares children to attend the kindergarten.

3- Raw’9a-Tamheedy (kindergarten): children attend tamheedy are usually of the ages 5-6. everything else is just the same as the previous level, raw’9a, only sometimes with longer attendance hours in an attempt of making the children more ready for the first grade of primary school, which is why we find that most of the children that don’t cry on their first day of primary school have actually attended this level of preschool (not because they get their clothes washed with comfort, vanish, or whatever product that tv commercial is meant to sell lol).

That was a brief preview of the preschool in iraq. What are your suggestions and comments about the system?


Udaisa,


P.S. Plz be objective with your posts.. And I beg you.. Plz don’t turn this topic into a K-1 fight.. Take it easy.. It don’t deserve it!

Lol, I think I’ll go first..

I have several suggestions concerning the preschool in iraq. Im not gonna mention them all in one post, but here are some:

First off, all levels of preschool should receive better attention from the government. Better buildings, better facilities, better staff, better programs, and even better toys should be provided. But this doesn’t count cuz im not suggesting a change in the system.

As for nursery school, we know that kids are sent to this school only when neither parent is available to nurse the children at home. So, attending such schools should stay voluntary, as it is now. In contrast, I think kindergarten level should be mandatory cuz most of the primary school children take a very long period of time till they get used to the idea of attending school slowing down other children. Not only this, if kindergarten becomes mandatory, primary schools can safely assume that children have received a certain level of education. And they can start where kindergarten ended rather than from zero.

Kindergarten is not mandatory in most of the countries around the world, even the most developed systems don’t necessarily require that. But, in all developed countries, people send their children voluntarily to kindergarten (which is why, in my opinion, they don’t need to make it mandatory).

If it seems hard for the government to take such a step, then therez an alternate. Not all primary schools should have the same level of education, or even the same curriculum (I’m going to talk about this in more detail when we discuss primary school on another topic inshalla). We can have some primary schools that provide higher levels of education than the ones currently exist. These schools can require children to attend kindergarten before getting admitted. We can also have elite primary schools with a bit more complex admission criteria (let’s leave the details for the primary school topic).

When kindergarten becomes mandatory (even if required by only few schools), pre-k will become the de facto first level of education in iraq cuz it prepares children to the kindergarten level and cause it takes place in the same places where kindergarten does.

I guess that’s pretty much it. What do you think?

I think I’ll post my other suggestions some other time, after I hear yours. Sorry for being long.

Udaisa

مساء الخير
عن الحضانه الي تكون في عمر صغير مثل ماذكرت معظمها تكون بسبب ضيق وقت الاباء وانشغالهم عن رعايه ابناءهم فيحاولون ان يجدو بدائل يعني هي حاجه وليست ضروره
وعلى مسوى شخصي اني اعتقد انو سلبياتها اكثر بكثير من ايجابياتها باعتبار الطفل يكون صغير جدا على مساله الانضباط والدوام والبهذله يوميه الصبح يودو يجيبوه فضلا عن ابتعاده عن امه وعائلته وهو في عمر مبكر ولفتره ليست بالقصيره من النهار راح يكون الها مردود سلبي على الطفل
غير انو الرعايه بالحضانه والعنايه المتوفره فيها لحاجات الطفل مهما وصلت من مستوى لن ترضي طموح الطفل
الام محد يعوض وجودها ابدا سيما في هذه المرحله المبكره من حياه الطفل
لكن الحاجه لذلك قد تظطر بعض العوائل الى اللجوء الى البدائل

هاي بالنسبه للحضانه رايي راح يتغير تماما من نوصل للروضه والتمهيدي
يعني لو تاملنا قليلا في المشاكل والصعوبات الي تواجه الطفل بمرحله الدراسه الابتدائيه راح نعرف اهميه الروضه
1) كلنا نتذكر ويمكن لازلنا لليوم نعاني من مشكله الدوام اليومي وكعده الصبح والانضباط والالتزام الي ينفرض على الطفل بمجرد دخوله للمدرسه
التحول الجذري والسريع من حاله الانفلات المطلق الي كان يتمتع بيها الطفل داخل منزله الي حاله الانضباط المطلق الي تنفرض عليه بالمدرسه والي يرافقها العقاب والتنانيب على الغياب حاله صعب على الطفل ان يتقبلها او يتحملها

2) كل واحد بينا هم جان عنده بطولات بحاله الخوف من الدوام والمدرسه بصف اول بعد الفرحه الغامره الي تصير اول ايام والي تتحول الى رعب وخوف وحالات نفسيه صعبه تمر علينا من يغيرولنا ملابسنا الصبح ويحملونا جنطنا ويوصلونا للمدرسه ( الله يساعدنا ) اما اذا عدنا امتحان فحدث ولاحرج والاصعب اذا تعرضنا لعقوبه معينه من المعلمه فالله يستر

فتره الروضه والتمهيدي باعتقادي تكون كفيله بتذليل هاي الصعوبات باعتبار انو الطفل راح يتعود على شي اسمه الالتزام بالدوام قبل ان يتفاجا بيه بالمدرسه هذا الانضباط الي بامكان الطفل ان يتخلف عنه بدون الخوف من العقاب الي قد يتعرض اله
يتعود على الاختلاط باقرانه بعيدا عن جو الدراسه والمواد العلميه والامتحانات الي هيواجها بعد فتره بالمدرسه
يتعود على فكره وجود المعلمه الي اكيد هتكون اكثر لطف ورقه من معلمه المدرسه الي هتطالب الطفل بتحضير واجباته وهتمتحنه ومو بعيد تعاقبه لسبب او لاخر (الله اكبر على كل ظالم ) ا

كل هاي الامور تجعل من المفيد جدا ارسال الطفل الى رياض الاطفال قبل المدرسه لكن نقص الثقافه في مجتمعنا بشكل عام عن اهميه رعايه الحاله النفسيه للطفل واهميه رياض الاطفال ودورها في ذلك تجعل معظم الناس ميفكرون اصلا في صرف اموالهم على شي يعتبره تافه وغير مهم في مستقبل اولادهم

اني اعتقد انو رعايه الدوله لمثل هاي المؤسسات شي مهم جدا بحيث تكون متوفره في معظم المناطق وقريبه من محل سكناهم وان تكون مجانيه حالها حال التعليم الابتدائي وياحبذا لو يقدمون وجبه غذائيه للاطفال بيها (تره هاي عوامل كلش مشجعه تخلي الناس يصير عدهم واهس يودون جهالهم للروضه) مع الحفاظ على عدم الالزاميه لان الي نريده هو نعود الطفل على الدوام والانضباط بعيدا عن حاله الخوف والهلع الي قد يعاني منها في مرحله المدرسه


تحياتي

nice one bro! lol


Hi again,

First, I’d like to thank you, precious, for sharing your opinion and I’m sure we would’ve heard more opinions if not most of the active members of the forum are busy these days.

About kindergarten’s being mandatory or not, I think we both agreed on how crucial this stage of kids’ life is. We both want parents to send their kids to pre-kindergarten and kindergarten (which is what matters the most), but we suggested two different ways to achieve that. And in the case of not making kindergarten mandatory, I suggested this:

Now, I’d like to mention one thing again here. As I first introduced this topic, I divided the preschool education into three levels. And what I suggested to be mandatory is only the third level, the kindergarten (tamheedy). Im only saying this again cuz this would help introduce the suggestion I’d like to talk about today.

I would like to separate the roles of the two raw’9a levels as follows: The first level would help the children be ready for some kind of discipline. And this level shouldn’t be mandatory for the same reasons precious mentioned. On the other hand, the role of the second level, the tamheedy, should be to prepare the kids to digest the subjects of the first grade of elementary school. This level is mandatory throughout most of the States, Canada, and Australia, which is why they sometimes refer to their educational system as the “K-12” system (i.e. kindergarten (tamheedy) to 12th grade (sadis i3dady)).

The thing I wanted to discuss in this post is: “what should be taught at this level, the tamheedy?”

We all know that children learn nothing at the tamheedy in iraq except for some songs and some ethical behaviors on how to respect the elders, help the needy… etc, which I don’t suggest to cancel. What I’m trying to say is that there are other things, not any less in importance, that should be taught. Have you noticed that children go to first grade illiterate (some children only master reading and writing after passing the third grade!!!)?? Have you noticed that first-grade children donno how to count from 1 to 10?? A six-year old who cannot count!!!! I know that all of you guys have learned to read, write, count, add, subtract… etc. before attending elementary school. But in spite of that, they wasted your time and made u go through all that again and your first math lesson was how to write number one because they couldn’t make sure that all children had got the same level of preparatory education.

What we conclude from that is that we need to put some standards for the subjects to be taught at the tamheedy level of preschool, so that children who have attended tamheedy can be assumed to have taken these subjects before, and they don’t need to take them again (i.e. in the case of tamheedy’s being mandatory, or in the case of making only some primary schools that require tamheedy as a prerequisite).

Well, I wanted to suggest an outline for the subjects to be taught at tamheedy but I’ve talked too much already, and I don’t wanna be more boring. So, I will continue talking about this later inshalla. And before I leave, I wanna remind you of the two questions raised in this topic till now:
- Should any of the preschool levels be mandatory?
- What should be taught at the tamheedy level, or any other level?

If you have an opinion concerning any of the issues above, or if you want to discuss any new suggestions related to the topic, you are most welcome to contribute here.

Thank you,

Udaisa

السلام عليكم
الموضوع حلو عاشت ايدك
اني راي انو الحضانة اذا مو الاهل مضطرين فالافضل ماكو لان الطفل راح يكون فد 6 الى 7 ساعات بالحضانة وهذا وقت كبير ومادام هو طفل راح يتشرب كل تصرف صح ان كان او خطا مة راح يكدر يفرزن بينهم
اما بالنسبة للروضة هم بعد وكت
لان احتمال راح يمل بسرعة من النضام والالتزام وراح ينفر من هذا الجو
اما بالنسبة للتمهيدي فاني كلش من المؤيدين الة لان هو فد سنة راح يكون الطفل يتعود بالتدرج على فد شي اسمة نضام وابتعاد عن الاهل والالتزام باوامر غير اهلة ويتعلم يكون اجتماعي ويكون صداقات وهكذا
واني اذكر من جنة بالاول الاطفال الي مة داخلين قبل للتمهيدي اهلهم فد اسبوع يداومون وياهم واذكر طالب جانت امة داوم ويا وتكعد ورا وكل 5 دقايق يجيك امة موجودة لو انهزمت ومن يشوفة طلعت من الصف يبدي البجي والعياط
اما بالنسبة لاي الاشياء واجب على الاطفال يتعلموهة هاي شوية صعبة لان ماكو منهاج محدد للتمهيدي حسب معرفتي يعني ماكو كتب خاصة او اي شي خاص بهاي المرحلة حسب الروضة ومنهاجهة كل وحدة شكل فلازم يكون نوع من التنسيق فمثلا التمهييدي من راح يكون الزامي راح وزارة التعليم تفرض منهاج تدريسي معين بحيث الطفل راح يكون مجتاز مرحلة معينة والابتدائية راح تكون خلي نكول مكملة يعني اكو نوع من التسلسل في المراحل
تحياتي
بروج

Hi all,

Thank you, shereen, for your rounded post. It’s a good thing that all of us agreed on not sending children to nursery school unless parents really have to. And you mentioned one of the most common negative effects that nursery school has on these little children.

And the fact that children believe that whatever “il sitt” says has to be right, no matter how hard parents try to convince them with the opposite, makes this a serious problem for parents, esp. when the “sitt” is not really qualified for the job of nursing little children (which is btw another flaw in the system. Cuz such staff should be trained and qualified with better attention).

True. But, for now, let’s just simply assume that we have two scenarios: 1) If tamheedy were to be made mandatory by the ministry of education, what classes do you think should be given? OR 2) what classes would you suggest for a newly-opened private kindergarten? if your suggestions differ for each case, please explain why.

As for me, I’ll post my suggestions later inshalla, cuz I really have to go asich! 3ndi tarakum bgad slema already! lol


Thank you

السلام عليكم
بالنسبة للمواد الي افضل ان ينطوهة
طبعا الموضوع ينرادله اشخاص واعين جدا ومحبين جدا ومقدرين اهمية هاي المرحلة
اذا نجي نشوف مثلا الاطفال الي بغير دول على سبيل المثال الاطفال الي يعزفون على اي الة تشوفهم اعمارهم صغيرة يمكن 5 او 6 لان الطفل يكون قابليتة على التعلم احسن واسرع وحتى اذا منتبهة احنة اول محاورة انكليزي ماخذيهة لحد الان حافضيهة بينما يمكن محاورة اخذناهة بالسادس ولا واحد منة يذكرها ومو لان جانت صعبة او سهلة بس لان الاطفال عدهم قابلية كلش زينة على الحفظ بس لو واحد يطوللهم خلك ويصبرلهم فاني ماعندي شي معين بس لو بدينة مثلا العزف هذا فد شي حلو وبسيط ويبدي الطفل يصير عندة وعي انو لازم يكون عندة فد هواية رغم الاهل راح ينضرون اذا الطفل اختار تعلم العزف على الطبل ههههههههههههههه
واي معلومات عامة حتى لو عن الفواكه والخضروات او الطبيعة اي شي ممكن يكون حولهم ويستفادون من بالحياة الواقعية وبصورة حلوة
هذا الي خطر على بالي حاليا
تحياتي للجميع
بروج

hi all,

thank you for your wonderful post, shereen. and this is exactly why this stage of schooling should not be neglected. kids are extraordinarily fast learners. and its true what u said about music. music and art classes are given at kindergarten worldwide, along with language, math, computers, science, and behaviors.

as for me, i don't think music and art are as essential as the other subjects (maybe cuz im not a fan of music or art lol).. but there should be a room for children to practice their various hobies, which may not be necessarily music or art. i especially emphasize the language (kids should learn to read and write before going to 1st grade), and math classes (kids should be able to count, add, subtract... etc). and of course im not taking anything from computers, science, and behaviors.

one final thing i'd like to discuss here.. or maybe i'll say what i think about it later inshalla, after u guys tell me what you think.. so, what do u think about what most of the private kindergartens in iraq are doing, i.e. giving english classes to 4 or 5 year old kids?????

looking forward for your posts,

Udaisa

السلام عليكم
بالنسبة لسؤالك
what do u think about what most of the private kindergartens in iraq are doing, i.e. giving english classes to 4 or 5 year old kids?????
اني ويا هم ماعندي اي مانع بالعكس كلش زين بس المهم الاسلوب الي يتعاملون ويا بحيث يخلون الطالب يكون عندة حب للتعلم مو يكره الشي الي كاعد يتعلمة مثلا يكوم يكره الانكليزي بدال ما يكرهة من الخامس او السادس ابتدائي يكوم يكرهة من الروضة
اني بالنسبة الي جان الدافع الي يخلينة اقرة اي مادة هو المدرسة الي تنطي المادة اذا اسلوبه حلو وحبابة راح اقرة المادة واحب الدرس اذ لا اكوم اكره الدرس وبالمناسبة اني اكره الانكليزي هههههههههههه من ورا مدرساتنة بس سنة وحدة حبيت خامس اعدادي وبعدين رديت كرهتة
ههههههههههههههههههههههه
تحياتي للجميع
بروج

Hey,

Good point of view, shereen.. So, the way classes are given matters more than the classes themselves.. and of course everything we’re suggesting here to be studied should be made and reviewed by specialists who know exactly how to educate children at these early ages.

I totally agree with shereen’s last post. But if what I suggested before was to be done, then maybe English would be too much to take, unless it was really really simple and was given in a very professional way that won’t confuse these young children. Cuz, of course, we want them to master their own language first and there will be more than enough time for them to learn English at elementary school.

Finally, I would like to thank precious and shereen for their participations here. And I would love to hear more of their (and other member’s) ideas. So, this topic is still open for new suggestions and ideas for a while before we start another topic. And btw, do you prefer our next topic to be about elementary school? Or should we talk about something else before we get to that?

Thank you all,

Udaisa